Not on their watch, by golly. Panic has set in with a small dish of the loudest North Dakota gun extremists. They felt a paranoid twinge and immediately turned up the dial on the “what don’t you understand about ‘shall not be infringed?’”
It’s not unusual. Many the hobby or ideology winds up with fanatics on the fringe. Most North Dakotans don’t own guns, but of those, the majority are hunters who keep their weapons locked in a safe until the proper season. They aren’t on the fringe.
The insecure fellows are the ones who are a little too attached to their chosen firearm. They and their fellow zealots are currently worked into a lather about the bipartisan action of 10 legislators.
Democratic Rep. Karla Rose Hanson and Democratic Sen. Erin Oban, plus eight Republican lawmakers, decided to do something proactive about dangerous people with guns before a Stoneman Douglas High School shooting gallery plays out in this state, not after. Or before another Fargo cop killing takes place. Perhaps Officer Jason Moszer may have been spared, had a walking red neon danger sign like Marcus Schumacher had been Red Flagged and law enforcement had a legal way to sequester Schumacher from his gun(s) at the time. Maybe.
- “The ‘Public Safety Protection Order Bill’ (aka a Red Flag law) allows law enforcement or family members to petition a court to temporarily ban someone considered a danger to themselves or others from possessing guns.” — KFGO
- “The Commission endorses Extreme Risk Protection Order laws, which give authorities a temporary way to keep those who threaten society from possessing or purchasing firearms.” — President Donald J. Trump’s Commission on School Safety
- “Because a suicidal person may have to wait to get their initial behavioral health services … a public safety protection order can put some time and distance between that person and lethal means while they get stable.” — Democratic Rep. Karla Rose Hanson
- “Public safety protection orders save lives by enabling people to act before warning signs escalate into tragedies.” — Rep. Karla Rose Hanson
- “The bill is supported by West Fargo Police Chief Heith Janke. ‘We need to provide the right tools to be pro-active in preventing these deaths’ Janke said. This bill provides an additional tool to hopefully save more lives and prevent more statistics from being made.” — KFGO
- “There are times where people go through crisis in life, there’s this window of instability in their life where perhaps them having access to a weapon isn’t the greatest thing in the world.” — Fargo Police Chief David Todd
- “Todd and Janke predicted officers would rarely use the new powers and said the bill provides adequate due process protections by requiring a hearing to determine whether an public safety protection order should be issued. It also allows firearm owners to seek an order’s termination.” — Bismarck Tribune
- “Vice President Pence highlighted the restraining orders during a meeting last month with President Trump and members of Congress in response to the Parkland shooting. Pence, a former governor of Indiana, said the laws allow due process, ‘so that no one’s rights are trampled.'” — USA Today
- “State Superintendent Kirsten Baesler called the legislation ‘one of the most significant’ ways policymakers could address school safety.” — Bismarck Tribune
Dana Loesch, the NRA’s spookiest spokesperson is pro-Red Flag, too.
- “I want to make a couple — one point. This is the eighth tragedy, the eighth tragedy where we have seen numerous tips that have been reported and red flagged — I mean— are we talking about prevention or not? I mean I think it’s incredibly important.” — (From a CNN town hall, February 22, 2018)
- “You have to follow up on these red flags.” (Ditto)
- “In an NRATV video, the group’s top lobbyist said Congress should provide funding for states to adopt ‘risk protection orders.’ But the association says its position hasn’t changed. “Our position has always been dangerous people should not have access to firearms,” said NRA spokeswoman Jennifer Baker.” — USA Today
OK. That all checks out.
So a large bipartisan group of lawmakers, the president of the United States, the State Superintendent of Education, the vice president of the United States, two police chiefs and the NRA’s first string spokespersons, are all for a common- sense law with due process protection that would save lives. What’s not to like?
Then, it begins. With a historical retort.
- “Wardner (Republican Senator Rich) said the bill takes a proactive approach to public safety and is ‘pro-gun’ because it could help prevent mass shootings that spur support for firearm restrictions.” — Bismarck Tribune
Wardner makes a logical case. Constant shootings don’t make for good marketing material. We’ve seen the backlash after a mass shooting before. But Rep. Rick Becker took the senator’s statement very hard. So, hard that he was forced to use a moldy Pol Pot reference:
- “If this is ‘Pro gun’, then Pol Pot was ‘pro life.’ Gimme a break …”
The new Dennis Miller, ladies and gents. As if the bartender had never taken away the keys from an inebriated customer at one of Becker’s establishments to prevent possible death and destruction. Maybe Rick did. Less hassle, but the same difference. People in vulnerable states aren’t that hard to spot. If it is hard to spot, you’ve been cheated out of some good observational tools.
Some regular people intervene in obviously dangerous situations all of the time without involving the legal system. “I don’t think depressed Cousin Alphonse needs a straight razor in this cabinet on this day in his life. Yoink.” “I’m keeping all of your guns at my house from now on, Uncle Rog. If you ever sober up and want to go hunting, that’s where they are. You won’t remember but that’s where they will be.” “Pack light. You’re leaving this house before he kills you.”
But sometimes, the legal system is needed because personal intervention isn’t possible.
But these extra industrial strength gun guys don’t care about that snowflake stuff. “Like she can’t survive a couple of small bullet wounds.”
T. Arthur Mason’s MinuteMan Blog went with the subtle headline below:
“ND Republican Traitors Stand with Democrats on Red Flag Gun Law,” T. howls into the cold dark night. Geez.
“Can you imagine the can of worms opened up by this definition? It’s not like false allegations aren’t a reality in our world today, right? And with the bar being as low as only having been arrested for a crime — not necessarily being convicted of one — where does that potentially leave those who are then wrongly accused of being dangerous? Yep, they may have just qualified as being ‘a risk of personal injury to self or others’ — and the state can seize their firearms.
“What about violence or cruelty to an animal? Depending on the judge, what might constitute that? Kicking the neighbor’s annoying dog when it strayed unwelcomed onto your property for the umpteenth time? Getting a tad irritable with that horse you’ve been trying to break to ride? The list is endless.”
I’ve never seen a can of worms, but I know that plenty of them have been opened. “Hello. Yes, Harry Smith is a danger to himself and others. No. That’s all. Goodbye now.” And off Harry’s gun(s) goes to what is commonly known as “Lizard Island.” Lots of lizards on that island, boy.
Red Flag laws are more subjective than the computer lists that pop out information for the Scheels clerk. They are better and millions of times less common. Yet, the T.’s of the world only bark at red and don’t even notice the lonely background check.
A Red Flag law does the same thing as a background check. We look at some clues and play the odds.
Most of the above nattering is stupid talk since his lame examples have nothing to do with the Red Flag Bill. But after some more grousing, he jumps right to a full ban on firearms. It’s an impressive leap.
“If they’re going to cede this ground, then where does it stop? Why not longer waiting periods and enhanced background checks? What about proficiency tests? Should we make people prove to the state that they are physically, mentally and emotionally stable enough to possess a firearm? Mandatory registration? Ah heck, why not go the whole way — let’s just ban firearms altogether?”
Cede this ground? Oh boy, the slippery slope has been introduced, like it is every time. You would think this country never had any gun control when it has since the beginning. It’s only been since the late 1970s when the NRA went to hair band nuclear fear level. “If you give an inch, the government is going to take your guns. Period.” And as with lots of things, like Donald Trump’s appeal, for example, we’ve never had a shortage of gullible people.
Then head Bastiat, stable genius and drama queen Rep. Rick Becker, puts out the “Yes, it’s that bad” <<<<ALERT>>>>> on Facebook. For Pete’s sake.
The Minuteman uses some choice words here, but I strongly suggest you read this. This is a terrible government overreach which does away with due process, the 4th Amendment, and the 2nd Amendment in one fell swoop.
“Call and email each of your legislators NOW! Share this! Fill the chamber, fill the room with citizens wanting to give testimony opposed. If you do not act on this strongly and swiftly, please never complain to me about losing your Second Amendment rights. Yes, it’s that bad”
Like the noncrisis at the southern border, the anti-Red Flag bullshit is at DefCon 32. No swooping will happen. Becker’s fans are easy to scare and they will be consumed with the swooping to come. Then the black helicopters.
- “Bismarck Republican Rep. Rick Becker, the chief backer of the ‘constitutional carry’ bill in the 2017 session, called Hanson’s legislation a ‘huge gun control maneuver’ taken ‘under the guise of having very good intentions’ that’s ‘ripe’ for abuse.” — Grand Forks Herald
Uh huh, It’s a “HUGE gun control maneuver” under a “GUISE” of some sort, that’s “RIPE for abuse.”
It’s a “HUGE gun control maneuver.” No, it isn’t.
A “GUISE.” Deceit is at play here. These people aren’t sincere in their concern for public safety. Well, that’s a lie.
“RIPE for abuse.” As if the plan you and Seabass have to let 18-year-olds carry loaded pistols into a SCHOOL isn’t ripe for abuse. But Rick knew that and did it anyway.
Oooh, and the potential false accusers. The rubes — you know where — are repackaging the “woman lie” campaign used heavily during the Brett Kavanaugh Supreme Court confirmation, to the “anybody could lie about you so Officer Joe will take your gun away for no good reason, without due process and something else.
What kind of people do you know? Maybe there’s something to look at in that area.
But what about Wilbur?
Wilbur has been waiting for years to plug Earl in the gizzard. They had a noteworthy dispute about a clothesline location long ago, but Earl’s always packing and is lightning fast on the draw. Too dangerous for Wil. So he waited all of these years for a Red Flag law to kick in. Then, Wilbur called the cops and tells them that Earl had a frowny face. (Actual Sayanythingblog comment.)
Because cops and judges are so stupid, you know. Of course, the cop tells a judge. The judge says, “take that man’s gun away for 10 days and give him some lashes with a dirty rope.” Earl will be gunless for a third of a month now. Wilbur is ready and shoots Earl right in the gullet. Earl is effectively deceased.
I don’t know why these people think that someone is out to get them, but there are plenty of ways to get revenge or pull a prank on a dude. Is depriving a man of his gun for a few weeks the proper level of pain to dole out? Is that the sweet spot between sending a hundred pizzas and falsely turning someone in for cooking meth?
And temporary separation from a gun isn’t a punishment. It’s possible prevention of misery for innocent people and the gun owner, and you would have to be on the stupid side of a bologna sandwich to file a false report with the police since doing so is a crime. But these dull-witted nuts think the police will be in on the wholesale “gun grabbing,” for the fun of it, I guess.
Who would decide? That’s a burning question for some, even though it’s laid out in the bill.
Well, it’s the same people you join for Thanksgiving dinner, the cop who decides if you are worthy of arrest for a DUI and the judge who decides things for a living. The same cast of characters as always.
POVnow on KVLY likes to frighten people without cause. Even though “refugees have TB” thing blew up in their face, they still aim for the FOX demographics.
- “Red Flag Laws might be coming to North Dakota. Do you trust friends and family members to decide if you are a danger? If so is this the best action to take? I wonder if there are other ways to handle this that does not infringe on our rights.” — Producer Josh
Coming UP: ND looks to pass a RED FLAG law that could infringe on YOUR gun rights. … I will break it down for you tonight.
POVnow wants to make it an issue of your families trustworthiness as if that’s in your worry sack. I’ve had guns and if someone would have hidden them for a week or month, I wouldn’t have melted down, suffered separation anxiety, or noticed. Metal and wood. Not once did I wonder, “What is my gun doing tonight? I hope it’s happy.”
The Fargo Forum blogger, who loves the word hubris, chimes in to feed his regulars.
- “It seems like hubris, to me, for we as a society to decide we know so much about what a person might do that we can act against their civil rights. More than that, it’s a dangerous legal precedent to set. Because if the government can deny you your 2nd amendment rights simply by deciding you’re too dangerous to exercise them, what else can they take from you?”— Rob Port, the Forum blogger most likely to wrestle a Coke machine.
What else can they take? Well, the government has been dying to get at your submarine sandwiches, Rob.
Port also spends oodles of his allotted Internet space to declare how a person and/or organization is really thinking, without any evidence, so he knows his hubris, although I don’t know what foolish pride has to do with this.
Then, Port writes this in his column for the Sunday paper:
Immediately, he starts with the deceit that makes him Rob Port.
“The person losing their civil right to keep and bear arms does not actually have to break any laws for this to take place. Others need only say the person is dangerous, putting that person in the position of preserving their rights only by convincing a judge they are not dangerous.”
Port purposely inverts the truth into a friggen lie. The burden of evidence falls on the person(s) who don’t want bad things happen. His “need only say” claim is pure port$#!*. Rob is one of those knuckleheads who thinks that a short call to the cops will get a guys ass hauled down to the courthouse minus his guns. Is Virginia Slim adding a “deliberately stupid” element to his “already stupid part? Yes, it’s personal.
“I am sympathetic to what Rep. Hanson and her coalition is trying to do — I am as against suicide and school shootings as anyone else — but this legislation is far too cavalier in its treatment of our rights.”
Rob is against these tragedies. He just doesn’t want to do anything about them. He extends his sympathies. And he doesn’t know what cavalier means. Probably not the definition of “sympathetic” either. Anyway, he cares an equal amount as anyone.
Rep. Luke Simons, another Bastiat tastelessly uses the slaughter at Wounded Knee on Facebook to make his case against a Red Flag law.
In Luke’s mind, the government is coming to collect all of the weapons, any day now, as it did to the Natives in the 1800s. But it’s not.
Then, all of the men, women, and children, are going to get murdered by our own government. That isn’t going to happen, either.
Another post of Simons.
“Folks I’ve asked many of you on Facebook to call your legislator on the Red flag bill, but be kind. A lot of these people/legislators are very good people, and they mean well. Say what you mean, but don’t say it mean.”
Too late. I wouldn’t say the majority of the sponsors to the B\bill are very good people, but a lot of them are. And cool hand Luke knew for certain that his fans would be “mean.” Yeah, I’m sorry my Rottweiler sicced himself on you, but I’ve given him a stern talking to.
Saving lives is a good thing in case the no, no, further, further than that, right wingtip Bastiat Caucus, in case they, especially Simons, forgot that the cell mass who can play the trumpet counts, too.
Nobody is getting executed or drenched with water and pushed into the cold. It’s just a preventative tool.
If you see your neighbor hauling firearms by the wheelbarrow full into their garage, and you’re afraid to ask him why the iduiliotis part of part of your brain lights up like Times Square and senses a firefight is near at hand. Call someone if you think that gunplay is important for someone to know. “If You See Something, Say Something®”
Stand Your Ground ND, a Facebook group has a late entry in the moronic category. Those clever boys photoshopped Superintendent Baesler’s face onto the body of an old-timey Russian soldier guy and made a meme. They used her words and a Lenin quote, just like this.
State Superintendent Kirsten Baesler — “called the legislation “one of the most significant” ways policymakers could address school safety.”
“Give me four years to teach the children and the seed I have sown will never be uprooted” — Vladimir Lenin
I guess that’s supposed to mean that Baesler is indoctrinating our youth. My brain doesn’t see the connection but I haven’t been breathing in a lot of gunpowder fumes lately.